:)
-- Message sent --
> ***
From Twist: ok. weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. <pulls mike away>
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehe
> ***
Rld just joined this channel!
> ***
From Twist: ahem. Awright folks, tonight we're going to look at
the most potent
plane in AW.
> ***
From Twist: There are better dogfighters, there are better
runners, but nothing
is more savagely
> ***
From Twist: lethal than the FW. It is _the_ plane to fly.
> ***
From Twist: Used properly it's my opinion the FW is unparalleled
at bagging
dweebs or even
> ***
From Twist: the occasional non dweeb (rare as they are). And,
it's a great
vulcher. heh.
***
From Twist: The first order of business with the FW as with any
plane in AW is
to know
> ***
From Twist: it's oustanding performance characteristics so that
you can
maximize those to
> ***
From Twist: your advantage when engaging.
> ***
From Twist: The FW's can be summarized as guns, speed,
maneuverability (NOT
necessarily turning)
> ***
From Twist: guns, toughness, and of course guns.
> ***
From Twist: did I mention guns?
> ***
From Twist: Ok. The weaknesses are as follows:
> ***
From Twist: bad sustained turn rate. Poor climb rate. That's
about it.
> ***
From Twist: Now, the essential problem that most people run into
in the FW is
that they
> ***
From Twist: are completely hooked on the idea of sustained turn
being the
primary performance
> ***
From Twist: consideration for a fighter. In real life this was
definitely not
the case, but
> ***
From Twist: in AW it can be perceived that way. Too many people
consider
"fight" to mean
> ***
Tsheehy just exited the teleconference.
> ***
From Twist: exclusively "dogfight". Just ain't so,
although that's what a lot
of people do in the arena.
> ***
From Twist: The Fw has the kind kind of _maneuverability_
required to win
"fights", but it
> ***
From Twist: doesn't have the ability to turn like a bumblebee
forever, like the
Spit or zeke.
> ***
From Twist: So if you are primarily what I call a "lift
vector" pilot - that
is, you only
> ***
From Twist: know how to put your lift vector on the opponent and
pull, you'll
have lots of
> ***
From Twist: problems.
> ***
Transmaniakon just switched to this channel!
> ***
From Twist: There's a few hard and fast rules that will help you
keep out of
trouble when
> ***
From Twist: you're learning the FW, and it's probably worth while
to go over
them first
> ***
From Twist: before anything else so they stick out in your mind.
> ***
From Twist: First, keep in mind the FW is not a good low-alt
fighter for
beginners.
> ***
From Twist: So take off from a clear field with time to climb,
pick a rear
field if you
> ***
From Twist: really want to be safe. Because of this you should
take a fair
amount of fuel,
> ***
From Twist: around 40-50% (it will last you a looong time in the
FW).
> ***
From Twist: Don't dither over taking less fuel to make you
maneuver/climb
better, because
> ***
From Twist: if you depend on that marginal an edge you're not
using the plane
right anyway.
> ***
From Twist: While you are learning consider your engagement area
to be above 8K
or so.
> ***
From Twist: This is your safety net to get away if you get in
trouble - a FW
with 8K has
> ***
From Twist: plenty of alt to use it's excellent evasive ability
to leave a
fight.
> ***
From Twist: Much lower than that and you'll get toasted by a Spit
or somesuch.
From Twist: Now, ideally you will want to engage lower opponents
to begin with
until you
> ***
From Twist: get used to maneuvers for close in combat. So 8K is
your min, and
you should
> ***
From Twist: think about having a 2-3K cushion over the highest
enema as well.
> ***
From Twist: There is no reason to go to nosebleed alt (unless
your enemy are
there already) as
> ***
From Twist: too MUCH alt will probably be more trouble than it's
worth.
> ***
From Twist: Another basic engagement philosophy is to keep your
speed HIGH at
all times
> ***
From Twist: unless you have a clear alt advantage over your
enemy. High speeds
are
> ***
From Twist: 250kts+. If you are making BnZ passes (we'll get into
this later)
make it 300kts.
From Twist: I'll summarize because they're important when you're
learning: 8K
minimum,
> ***
From Twist: start with 2-3K at least on highest opponent, keep
speed >250kts
all times.
> ***
From Twist: Those basic rules apply for any boom and zoom type of
operation
anyway, but
> ***
From Twist: they're particularly vital to the FW becuase it if
you're not very
familiar
> ***
From Twist: with it it will get you killed fast when you ignore
them.
> ***
From Twist: Now, I mentioned before that the Fw is very
maneuverable, but at
the same time
> ***
From Twist: I said it doesn't have a good sustained turn rate.
This often
confuses people.
> ***
From Twist: The point is the FW does everything great except that
one limited
aspect of
> ***
From Twist: maneuverability which is the turn. It has the best
roll rate in AW
for instance,
> ***
From Twist: and it keeps that roll rate very well at high speeds.
Further, it
doesn't compress
> ***
From Twist: very much and will respond fairly predictably at any
speed above
200kts to stick input.
***
From Twist: Both of these are good characteristics both on attack
and on
defense, so that's
> ***
From Twist: why you'll hear me say it has "good
maneuverability".
> ***
From Twist: Also note that in turn rates I always mention
sustained turn rate.
The FW
> ***
From Twist: can actually get a great initial turn radius from
speed, a vital
component of
> ***
From Twist: many attack strategies, the only problem is it can't
KEEP turning
worth a damn.
> ***
From Twist: This is what seperates an experienced FW pilot from
not -
experienced ones know
> ***
From Twist: when and how to use that one shot they get at a good
turn, dweebs
don't :-).
> ***
From Twist: Let's look at that a little more in depth for a
minute. Say you are
flying
> ***
From Twist: along in a FW and a Spit is right next to you, you're
both going
300kts.
> ***
From Twist: If you and the spit both roll 90 degrees and do a
horizontal bank,
it seems
> ***
From Twist: reasonable that the Spit would have a much lower turn
radius
because it has a
> ***
From Twist: much higher turn rate in degrees/sec.
> ***
From Twist: But in point of fact the FW and Spit will have very
close
characteristics for
> ***
From Twist: the first loop or so, because the Spit keeps it's
energy so well it
keeps going
> ***
From Twist: much faster than the FW.
> ***
From Twist: Since spit is going much faster, it covers more
distance per sec
than the FW,
> ***
From Twist: making it's turn radius wider, and it then uses it's
superior turn
rate to make up for that.
> ***
From Twist: In point of fact it's often very difficult for a Spit
pilot to
match a FW
> ***
From Twist: in an initial turn because the Spit will have to chop
throttle hard
to get
> ***
From Twist: anywhere need the speed bleed of the FW. So, if
you're in the FW
you can
> ***
From Twist: actually use your major disadvantage (bleeding speed)
to your
advantage at times.
> ***
From Twist: As a rule of thumb in the arena, if you decide to try
to apply this
and you
> ***
From Twist: haven't gained significant angles on the opponent by
the time
you're down to
> ***
From Twist: 200kts, you've probably blown it and you need to get
out of dodge
quickly.
> ***
From Twist: <that's where your 8K cushion comes in for
instance>
> ***
From Twist: any questions on any of this so far?
> ***
From Gmcbride: neg
> ***
From Twist: Is that a snore I hear?
> ***
From Robinhood: No questions
> hehehe
> ***
From Gmcbride: (wake up Rash!)
> ***
From Rld: go ahead twist
> ***
From Transmaniakon: <cough> :)
> ***
From Twist: somebody give Rash another beer.
> Rash not here. <G>
> ***
From Twist: anyway, a couple of you are probably wondering how
everybody seems
to
> ***
From Twist: be getting kils in low and slow FWs if I'm correct
with most of the
above stuff.
> ***
From Twist: Basically, most of them cheat. Not in the sense of
hacking a FE or
anything,
> ***
From Twist: but they take advantage of inadequacies in the AW
spin model to
escape some
> ***
From Twist: of the limitations of the FW as a plane. The long and
short of it
is that if
> ***
From Twist: you practice long enough, you can become
"skilled" at deliberately
causing a
> ***
From Twist: spin in a FW and recovering with fair amount of
predictability.
> ***
From Twist: As in, you can recover with a guns solution on your
opponent.
> ***
From Twist: Since a plane in a spin is nearly impossible to hit
given our
gunnery model
> ***
From Twist: (hell, planes flying straight and level are nearly
impossible to
hit most of
> ***
From Transmaniakon: !
> ***
From Twist: the time) this can be very effective. But it's not
realistic, nor
is it based
> ***
From Twist: on any solid knowledge of ACM. Ga Trans.
> ***
From Transmaniakon: just call me TK :) Can u control a spin that
well?
> ***
From Twist: Yes. In certain planes I can drop into a spin and
recover exactly
on the
> ***
From Twist: opponents tail. Yak is the worst, FW, 109, Spit all
exhibit the
characteristic.
> ***
From Transmaniakon: Is there talk of fix for spins in 1.5?
> ***
From Twist: Actually it's very likely this will be fixed in a
sense with 1.18
(or whatever
> ***
From Twist: the next release becomes).
> ***
From Twist: Kesmai isn't particularly happy with unrealistic
options being
given to the player
> ***
From Twist: so they're likely to implement tougher spin recover
in the next
release.
> ***
From Transmaniakon: Good... spinning on purpose seems pretty
cheesy
> ***
From Twist: That hasn't been set in stone tho, so don't try to
hold them to it.
> ***
From Twist: Spinning is valid if you are playing the game instead
of the
simulation.
> ***
From Twist: It is absolutely unnecessary to spin the FW to get
lots of kills in
it.
> ***
From Twist: It's a sore subject with a lot of players, and not
everybody holds
my view.
> ***
From Twist: I wanted to bring it up merely to say that I'm not
going to teach
you how to
> ***
From Twist: do it :-O.
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehehe
> ***
From Shadownyc: hehe
> ***
From Twist: Also note that when we do get a real force model
"spinfighters"
will be
> ***
From Twist: deadfighters in very short order.
> ***
From Twist: the only other thing I'll mention about spins is how
to recover
from them
> ***
From Twist: since they are a reality in the FW as with any other
plane.
> ***
From Twist: The standard solution applies: apply rudder opposite
the direction
of the
> ***
From Twist: spin, neutral stick at first and try a little jerks
opposite the
spin direction
> ***
From Twist: if you have trouble with the rudder. The latter isn't
realistic at
all btw
> ***
From Twist: but it works, sigh.
> ***
From Twist: The FW had unusual spin characteristics which are
sort of modelled
in AW:
> ***
From Twist: it tends to flip over on it's back when it spins,
which can be sort
of
> ***
From Twist: annoying. But it doesn't effect recovery.
> ***
From Twist: Interesting to note btw that the rudder action should
be REVERSED
when you
> ***
From Twist: are upside down (you should rudder TOWARDS the spin)
but AW messes
it up :-)
> ***
From Rld: do you need to chop throttle?
> ***
From Twist: Not particularly, although you should unflap of
course.
> ***
From Twist: If you leave your flaps down and you take too long to
recover, you
can get
> ***
From Twist: severly hosed when you snap out, because you'll be
going too fast
and
> ***
From Twist: immediately fall into compression.
> ***
From Twist: Hey shebop can we take 2 min break? potential dog
issue here.
> sure thing.
***
From Gmcbride: hehehehehe
> ***
From Twist: cc brb
> seventh inning stretch...
> ***
From Gmcbride: brb too
> ***
Gmcbride just exited the teleconference.
> should have the bud light guy doing a commercial or
something...:)
> ***
From Shadownyc: hehe
From Twist: Ok they just mad because they can't kill neighbors
cat.
> oh, why not? <BG>
> ***
From Shadownyc: the Cat's winning tis all ;)
> ***
From Twist: Don't want the blood on my driveway...ill wait until
it crosses
street.
> hehehe
> ***
Gmcbride just joined this channel!
> okay...where wuz we...
> ***
From Twist: Bout to get to keeling people.
From Twist: Ok, you've got the basic rules of engagement, now
what do you do.
Well, the
> ***
Porn just switched to this channel!
***
From Twist: best thing when you're learning is to find people
that are already
fighting
> ***
From Twist: to kill as they'll be easy targets :-). Until you're
very
comfortable with
> ***
From Twist: evading close-ins I don't recommend just going out
and finding 1v1
situations.
> ***
From Twist: Best possible scenario is to find a bunch of
stallfighters from
opposite
> ***
From Twist: countries all in one dweeby little cloud.
> ***
From Twist: Mmmmmmmm, yummmy.
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehehe
> ***
From Twist: Now a lot of people when they're learning FW or
energy don't pick
very good
> ***
From Twist: approaches to a fight. In the situation above you'll
get tempted
sometimes to
> ***
From Twist: fly over the cloud, pick a target, and dive in. This
is probably
the most
> ***
From Twist: difficult way to get a shot, although it's the
easiest to
visualize.
> ***
From Twist: What you want to do instead is start a shallow dive
(remember, 2-3K
above your
> ***
From Twist: highest enemy to begin with until later) and level
out when you are
about
> ***
From Twist: 1K or so away from the fight. You precede through the
fight
basically flying
> ***
Hotrail just vanished!
> ***
From Twist: level and pick the target as you approach. After you
pass through
(300kts)
> ***
From Twist: either go into a low-G zoom, or roll slightly 10-30
degrees and
zoom.
> ***
From Twist: Ga HR.
> ***
From Shadownyc: he went
> ***
From Twist: oh so he did
> ***
From Twist: ok, a basic trick I learned early on to help when you
are doing
this is
> ***
From Twist: to find a set of stallfighters following each other
around (not
hard to do).
> ***
From Twist: Now, your eventual target is the guy in the rear
position, but what
you do
> ***
From Twist: to help your timing is you follow the guy in the LEAD
position of
the
> ***
From Twist: stallfight. Since the guy in the rear is following
the one you key
off of,
> ***
From Twist: any manuever your key makes the rear will make as
well, but you get
some
> ***
From Twist: extra time to react as maneuvers occur.
> ***
From Twist: Of course if you get the opportunity and the lead guy
gives you a
good shot,
> ***
From Gmcbride: ah hah! <light comes on>
> ***
From Twist: just take that. No reason to be picky.
> ***
From Twist: You'll find if you do this that many times it will
seem that
fighters just
> ***
From Twist: magically line up in front of you as you approach the
furball.
Great fun
> ***
From Twist: when you've got a mobile FP as far as the guns go.
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehhe
> ***
From Twist: If you keep a shallow dive angle to begin with and
don't get harsh
on the
> ***
From Porn: !I would imagine you would have to watch your speed
closely around
the stallfight eh?
> ***
From Twist: stick as you approach from 1K out, you should have a
full "black
out reserve"
> ***
From Twist: when you get to the furball. Yes Porn, you should be
going 300kts
or so in
> ***
From Twist: the approach I describe.
> ***
From Twist: A black out reserve means that you can pull
momentarily high Gs,
and you
> ***
From Twist: should wait to use this until you are right on top of
the fight, as
a last
> ***
From Twist: second measure to get a slightly better angle on the
victim.
> ***
From Twist: If you're going 300kts and you pull to black out
once, you should
still have
> ***
From Twist: plenty of speed to exit the furball and re-assess as
you climb out.
> ***
From Twist: Don't just sit there and ham the stick around. If you
blow the
pass, no big
> ***
From Twist: deal, just climb out and reset for a new one.
> ***
From Transmaniakon: !
> ***
From Twist: GA TK.
> ***
From Transmaniakon: hey twist I gotta run...
> ***
From Transmaniakon: are u gonna have another class on fw?
> ***
From Twist: there's one scheduled, I'll be here but don't know
how many others
will.
> ***
From Twist: it's on friday.
> ***
From Transmaniakon: ok cool I will cya then thanks... bye
> ***
From Twist: ok.
> ***
Transmaniakon just exited the teleconference.
> ***
From Twist: hey how long is this supposed to go anyway ? heh.
> we've been going till eleven, but 10:30-11 ok
> ***
From Shadownyc: Till u teach Robinhood to kill drum :)
> ***
From Twist: ok.
***
From Robinhood: <g> been there done that
> ***
From Shadownyc: hehe
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehehe, better learn to spin then :)
> ***
From Robinhood: cc
> ***
From Twist: awright, so we've covered what your engagement
parameters should
be, what
> ***
From Twist: your approach is, now we'll look at what happens
after pass.
> ***
From Twist: As I mentioned you should use a low-G extension as
you leave the
furball,
> ***
From Twist: probably no more than 4Gs, settle down to a 30-45
degree climb max.
> ***
From Twist: As you do that you should be cycling ALL views. Since
you've been
busy
> ***
From Twist: trying to pick targets and firing on your pass,
you've been focused
elsewhere
> ***
From Twist: and the situation may have changed since you started
the attack.
> ***
From Twist: The absolute WORST thing you can do is to get all
fixated on the
guy you
> ***
From Twist: just made a pass at. he's behind you and (likely)
busy, he's not a
threat.
> ***
From Twist: So, look around. If you see somebody higher than you,
you have to
reassign
> ***
From Twist: him as the primary threat. There are two things you
do with a
primary threat:
> ***
From Twist: kill it or run away from it. Your choice, but the
point is if
somebody has
> ***
From Twist: gotten higher than you the last pass is completely
meaningless now.
It's now
> ***
From Twist: a fight between you and the highest threat.
> ***
From Twist: If nobody is as high as you are, look for anybody
that has a very
high
> ***
From Twist: closure rate to you. If they do, try to figure out
what their
approach
> ***
From Twist: angle is. If they're catching up to you at a pursuit
angle, then
THEY
> ***
From Twist: are your highest threat. Any closure from a rear
angle is
dangerous, fast
> ***
From Twist: closure is trouble.
> ***
From Twist: If neither of these conditions exist, then you're ok.
Then and only
then
> ***
From Twist: do you turn your attention back to the furball and
your target,
assuming
> ***
From Twist: he's not already dead from your first pass. You can
just set up
again on him
> ***
From Twist: using the same method and keep working it until you
get him.
> ***
From Twist: In terms of threat assessment the biggest problem new
people have
is dealing
> ***
From Twist: with dots that are out of con. You'll just have to
get used to
trying to
> ***
From Twist: estimate based on their movement relative to you. If
you don't
trust your
> ***
From Twist: ability to do this than follow a simple "higher
is danger" rule and
extend
> ***
From Twist: opposite direction from any dot co-alt or higher.
> ***
From Twist: Ok, last topic will cover in the beginners section
here is basic
evasives.
> ***
From Twist: This is for when something goes wrong. You get jumped
by a Spit you
didn't
> ***
From Twist: see, you dive in from directly above the furball
(baaad FW pilot!
bad!) and
> ***
From Twist: fall below the altitude of the fight, etc.
> ***
From Twist: Basically if you've kept your 8K cushion then you
will find it very
easy
> ***
From Twist: to avoid most stallfighters with practice. P51s and
other FWs are
your
> ***
From Twist: biggest enemy, and if you let more than one of them
jump you,
you're in big
> ***
From Twist: trouble (and you didn't pay attention during the
threat assement
part of the
> ***
From Twist: lecture).
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehhehe
> :)
> ***
From Twist: You'll have to trust me on this one: a FW pilot who
is comfortable
with
> ***
From Twist: evasives (ie, he's practiced them) has very little to
fear from a
single
> ***
From Twist: Spitfire for example. Regardless of the Spitfires
altitude.
> ***
From Twist: In fact a FW can run from just about anything except
another FW.
> ***
From Twist: The central reason for this is your incredible turn
rate. Use it.
Use it
> ***
From Shadownyc: roll rate
> ***
From Twist: a lot, at high speeds, several times, and any
spitfire will be left
in
> ***
From Twist: the dust (sorry, roll rate is correct)
> ***
From Twist: You can try this off line - get most planes up to
300kts or so and
they
> ***
From Twist: turn into absolute much. They get slow rolls, and
even very small
sitck
> ***
From Twist: er stick deflections cause blackouts.
> ***
From Twist: Not so with the FW. it's just getting rolling at 300
and can easily
maneuver
> ***
From Twist: at speeds of up to 450kts.
> ***
From Twist: So, let's say you're jumped by a Spitfire with alt
(prolly worst
case scenario
> ***
From Twist: for opposing planes, in stallfighters).
> ***
From Twist: Immediately you should get your nose pointed down
unless you are
already
> ***
From Twist: going 300kts or so. Your target velocity is going to
be around 300.
Don't
> ***
From Twist: waste time diving to get above 300 because you'll use
alt that you
shouldn't
> ***
From Twist: have to.
> ***
From Twist: Ok, if the spit is diving from well above a real
basic trick is to
fly
> ***
From Twist: straight and level, giving him a nice even target,
and watch his
approach.
> ***
From Twist: he'll likely get caught up in an "easy
kill" and dive hard to catch
up with
> ***
From Twist: you. Wait until he is about 2000-1600 yards, roll on
your back, and
pull
> ***
From Twist: opposite his approach direction to start with.
> ***
From Twist: If he's going real fast just this one maneuver will
confound him,
because
> ***
From Twist: he a) can't roll like you can and b) going that speed
can't turn at
all
> ***
From Twist: until he dumps a bunch of speed.
> ***
From Twist: If you saw him going a pretty steady speed on
approach, he's
probably smart
> ***
From Twist: and has chopped throttle as he comes in. This is
dangerous and
implies a s
> ***
From Twist: stallfighter who actually knows what he's doing.
> ***
From Twist: If you can recognize this happening, then start a
dive as he
approaches
> ***
From Twist: you. This will force him to speed up to catch up with
you and get
him up
> ***
From Twist: to the speeds at which you can easily evade him. It's
sort of a
paradox in
> ***
From Twist: that the easiest way to avoid a stallfighter is to
get him going
FAST (the
> ***
From Twist: trick is you get him going fast the wrong direction).
> ***
From Twist: Ok, let's say you've done the above and you're doing
about 300 with
a spit
> ***
From Twist: behind you and closing (presumably slowly).
> ***
From Twist: Again you should roll on your back to start, and
start a split-S or
something
> ***
From Twist: close to it in terms of angles. The key is to be nose
down so
you're
> ***
From Twist: accumulating speed the entire time to fight your
bleed tendacies.
Remember
> ***
From Twist: that the Spit will have to be all over his throttle
control to
match your
> ***
From Twist: bleed characteristics, giving him one more thing to
worry about
than you have.
> ***
From Twist: After you start a split-s (or angle dive), pull about
1/3-1/2 into
it at
> ***
From Twist: a steady 4-5Gs, then do about a quarter roll in any
direction and
continute
> ***
From Twist: er continue to pull about 4-5gs. If you're going 300
a pursuing
stallfighter
> ***
From Twist: will have a VERY hard time matching this, because
they can't roll
well at high
> ***
From Twist: speeds.
> ***
From Twist: you may have to repeat with a few rolls, but keep in
mind what your
eventual
> ***
From Twist: egress direction should be - you SHOULD know that
before you start
the
> ***
From Twist: evasives, in fact you should have it figured before
you even engage
anybody,
> ***
From Twist: just in case.
> ***
From Twist: As you go through your rolls and 4-5G pulls time them
so you end up
on your
> ***
From Twist: egress angle. If you pull 2-3 rolls and keep your
speed =>300kts,
it will
> ***
From Twist: be a very rare stallfighter than can follow you
through to your
egress direction.
> ***
From Twist: Once you are level at 300kts and the Spit is behind
you >1600kts
with no
> ***
From Twist: closure or alt, you are home free. No stallfighter
can catch the
190 in
> ***
From Twist: level flight, high speed.
> ***
From Twist: <They will try though, which is pretty amusing>
> ***
From Twist: The procedure is largely the same with other FWs or
51s, but you
have to
> ***
From Twist: execute that much better because these planes are
better suited to
the high
> ***
From Twist: speed maneuvers you're performing. Practice offline
by starting at
10K, going
> ***
From Twist: any random direction, and pick an egress direction.
use the above
maneuvers
> ***
From Twist: but try to pull as close to an absolute 6Gs as you go
through the
roll/pulls
> ***
From Twist: as you can, and see how consistently you can do this
without
blacking out and
> ***
From Twist: still ending up on the egress route.
> ***
From Twist: Them's the basics of how to use it, how to attack,
and how to
evade.
> ***
From Twist: I'll talk about fancy stuff like hammerheads and
flaps on Friday.
heh.
> Okay folks, we'll wrap it here - does anyone have any
questions before we do...
> And I have an announcement to make before y'all split.
<G>
***
From Robinhood: Nope
From Gmcbride: hehhehe wass just getting ready to ask about
flaps :)
> ***
From Robinhood: Great class Twist, thanks.
> ***
From Porn: Excellent twist
> ***
From Rld: tnx twist
> Just to let you all know...due to Saturday's warnight...
***
From Shadownyc: good stuff <in my Carson impression>
> Robert Shaw has graciously allowed us to postpone his
conference...
***
From Twist: glad folks liked it. We need more good FW fliers. A
good plane for
Hate.
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehe rgr
> so the Shaw conference will be held Tuesday night at 9pm instead of this Saturday.
> ***
From Robinhood: cc Shebop
> That way, we can all go to both. <G>
***
From Shadownyc: cool
> ***
From Porn: rgr that
> ***
From Twist: Shaw is always a great speaker (typer) so you should
definitely
make that.
> Yes, he's done conferences for me before, and they are great
> Thanks, Twist - excellent class.
> Tomorrow night continues with deadduck and energy
management...Friday night is the second half of this class...
***
From Rld: tnx Shepbop, didn't mean to make trouble
> You didn't Nor, what makes you think you did? <G>
> Except, you *did* call me Shepbop. :)
> ***
From Gmcbride: geez, you all wwould have these things when I
working 4-midnite
> ***
From Gmcbride: :)
> Aww...sorry...:(
***
From Rld: i whined on the bb
> ***
From Twist: Isn't that what BBs are for?
> I don't mind whining...not much, anyway. <G>
***
From Twist: That and making fun of dweebs.
> hehehehe
> That what I am there for to listen to the whining
***
From Gmcbride: hehehehe no prob, took vacation for thiss :)
> ***
From Robinhood: There are always the logs of the classes
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehehehe
> ***
From Shadownyc: hehehe
> ***
From Gmcbride: rgr RH, more fun being here tho :)
> absoltely. :)
> absolutely even
***
From Robinhood: cc couldn't agree more.
> ***
From Gmcbride: hehehehe
> ***
From Porn: There's logs of these classes
> yes, in the help and training database
> Twist, I won;t be here Friday, merchant will moderate for
you and keep the log
***
From Gmcbride: thxsss Twissst, gave me some good ideass :)
> ***
From Sherlock: dloading using telnet is hard:)
> ***
From Porn: Excellent This is the first I stumbled upon
> -- Message sent --
> ***
From Porn: Lovinging it
> Sherlock, can you use rlogin?
***
From Twist: ok I'll try not to be too hard on him.
> hehehehe
> he can take it
> Porn, that's why you gotta read the BB - keep on top of
these things <G>
***
From Sherlock: I have a site where I can use rlogin but that
didn't seem to
work either
> rlogin should work
> twist, isn;t there a switch he's got to use for rlogin?
<major brain flush here>
***
From Sherlock: I get loads of characters like }-4
> ***
From Porn: Roger that
> ***
From Rld: At work i have to use telnet to get through firewall
> ***
From Robinhood: See ya'll Friday
> cya Robin
***
From Twist: -8 for binary?
> yeah that be the one
***
Robinhood just exited the teleconference.
> ***
From Shadownyc: cya robin
Gmcbride just exited the teleconference.
>
END LOG
FW Strategies 2: (Lecture by Twist cont)